Tagged: @rleder @robertross @jkallmeyer
July 12, 2016 at 9:34 pm #6652
OK, this has potential but don’t I need to know where to tell it to transfer the files? And if so, where would that be?
JackJuly 13, 2016 at 2:08 pm #6657
yes you will need to enter my email address and then the website will send me a note that I can download the files. If you scroll in the little box on the right next to the upload box you will find the explanation how it works. And this is my email address:
RonnyJuly 13, 2016 at 9:19 pm #6685
@rleder It looks like this transfer worked. Would you mind transferring the completed edited video back to me for my personal archives? Thanks
JackJuly 13, 2016 at 10:13 pm #6699
yes it takes a while to download the file but it is just a matter of time and waiting. Ahh and yes, of course will I send you the edited video … that is understood 😉
all the best
RonnyJuly 13, 2016 at 11:50 pm #6718
I have now the polish video but I am missing the cutting video … did you send that as well???July 14, 2016 at 1:09 pm #6721
I uploaded three MP4 files. The file names were:
MAH00019 This is the cutting video about 235MB
MAH00020 This is the grind/sanding video about 901MB
MAH00021 This is the final polish video about 212MB
What did you download on your end?
JackJuly 14, 2016 at 1:21 pm #6722
@jkallmeyer, I have downloaded the MAH00020, I simply clicked the invitation and that was all I could downloadJuly 20, 2016 at 5:02 pm #7084Robert RossParticipant
I am following up on some interesting earlier posts in February and March about rewoquat and its US equivalent. I used Quaternary-O as a lab technician many years ago and now have a variety of samples on which I’d like to use something similar. Matthew, how did the sample of Rewoquat work out? You said that you received a sample of Rewoquat “W 3690 PG” — is that the variety (I see there are 9 varieties at the Evonik website) that you or Evonik thought would be the most appropriate for breaking up clay-rich rocks? Is it your sense there might be a way for folks to order small to modest amounts in the US?
Rob RossJuly 27, 2016 at 11:49 am #7105
Hey Rob (@robertross),
Since Matthew is not responding I will try to answer your question. Yes it is the stuff you should use for breaking up clay-rich rocks but you might have to dissolute it in Isopropanol to get a 75% solution. I guess there might be a chance to order Rewoquat but not in small amounts. The easiest way is to contact the German headquarter and ask. If they just ship large amounts then we probably can order and split it for all parties interested.
RonnyJuly 27, 2016 at 12:22 pm #7106
Also keep in mind that the fossils, embedded in silt and clay, should be as dry as possible since water will react with Rewoquat to a hardly removable gel. Rewoquat will not work with clayish matrix with high content of glimmer minerals (mica). For very delicate and fragile fossils it is recommended to dissolute Rewoquat to a 30-40% solution. Just leave the fossils in the glass jars with Rewoquat over night. Rewoquat dissolutes in very hot water (at least 60 degree Celsius, better 80 degree Celsius). That way you can clean fossils from Rewoquat. Then you just have to store the fossils in a jar with water and the rest of the gel will move up in the jar as tiny clouds and you can easily remove it. You can reuse Rewoquat since the silt and clay will sink down in the solution. You can use one jar with Rewoquat for about 20 times, then you need to clean it. Just let it stay until the mineral fraction is completely separated from the solution at the bottom of the jar and carefully decant the clear Rewoquat. That way you can use it for years. It might get thick over time but you can easily dissolute it again with Isopropanol.
RonnyJuly 28, 2016 at 1:00 pm #7107
How’s the video coming? I have no concept of the time involved in doing the editing.
JackAugust 8, 2016 at 5:02 pm #7159
Any progress to report on the polish video? I’m pretty sure Hollywood will be after me once it’s posted so I am anxious about that!
JackAugust 9, 2016 at 12:04 pm #7162
Hey Jack (@jkallmeyer), it is done! Here you can watch the extended version of it. I will also edit a shorter version of it for the not so patient folks. Please give me feedback. If you don’t like it just tell me and I can remove it but I think it is nice and very informative.
RonnyAugust 9, 2016 at 12:09 pm #7163
btw I like it since it is really funny … “… a fossil that only a mother could probably love…” lol, so great
I tried to reduce the background noise as much as possible but still let you sound natural …
RonnyAugust 9, 2016 at 9:55 pm #7178
Great intro music! Very heroic. I’m glad you did this as what you did is beyond my ability.
Overall it works really well. I especially like the fast forward approach (I wish I could get my arms to move that fast!).
I have two suggestions if you can do it.
1) The sawing is jerky because of your cuts to shorten that time. I think it looks odd and doesn’t give a flavor for how fast (slow) it actually is. The real time actual sawing process isn’t very long. Could you put it in without cuts?
2) Since the video was edited for time, could you put a note at the bottom at the end to tell people the total elapsed time? Or maybe do that at the end of each segment giving a saw time, a grind time, and a polish time?
BTW, I saw what you did there with that saw mark slide. You and I know that was illustrative not factual. 😉 . If you want, I could probably give you an actual saw mark photo.
JackAugust 11, 2016 at 9:39 am #7340
Hey Jack @jkallmeyer,
Thanks for your suggestions. I will implement it. I don’t think we need a picture of the saw marks since this is more for explanation and the fake marks work better but if you insist to have the real marks I can do that as well.
RonnyAugust 11, 2016 at 12:14 pm #7630
Jack I have checked the video to implement your suggestions and just realized that the real time sawing process takes almost 2 minutes. From our experience the focus time of the people watching videos like that is just very short. Even 20 seconds watching that section will make them switch the video and check another one. I added a note that the real time process takes 2 minutes and hope that will please your wishes. I also included a notification that the polishing process takes almost 2 hours.
RonnyAugust 11, 2016 at 1:00 pm #7640
I see your point about the time for sawing. I would suggest that if it needs to be cut that you do so only once to take a piece out of the middle. It appeared to me that multiple cuts were made making it very jerky. Maybe I am misinterpreting what I saw. Maybe you could also add one of your “fast forward” notes to the cutting as well. What do you think?
I’ll make a saw cut mark photo a bit later today. You can use it if you want – or not.
JackAugust 11, 2016 at 1:19 pm #7642
here is the new version of it and I hope you like it
RonnySeptember 7, 2016 at 10:08 pm #11318Matthew SpeightsParticipant
@robertross @jkallmeyer and @rleder, I apologize for taking so long to get back to this thread. I mostly put aside fossil activities for several months (with a few collecting trips that I just had to take…) to build a New Guinea biotope paludarium for my wife. Now that my living room is a jungle, I’m getting back into paleontology.
Back in the Spring, I started trying to track down a replacement for “Rock Quat” or “Quaternary O.” It appeared that a good replacement that was manufactured recently would be Rewoquat W 3690 PG, the specific formula used in this paper on microfossil extraction. After many emails and tracking down the company (Evonik) and manager, I finally got to the right person, who was so kind as to send me a sample. It turns out that, although Rewoquat W 3690 PG is only distributed in Germany, a similar formula with a different name and higher concentration (90% instead of 75%) is available in the USA, Varisoft 3690 PG.
I received a one pint sample of Varisoft 3690 PG, and although I haven’t had time to run many tests, I did place several trilobites in it for several weeks. It was quite viscous (only a little less so than petroleum jelly), so I diluted it with ethanol (190-proof Everclear…”No, it’s actually for fossils.” 🙂 ). As you can see from the attached image of four Flexicalymene retrorsa minuens, it worked very well to disaggregate the shale around them. After removing them from the solution, I rinsed them with hot water and brushed them a little to remove the solution and any residual shale. If you really wanted to speed up the process, perhaps you could boil them like they used to with Quat-O and a lab hot plate at University of Cincinnati. Disclaimer: I would definitely read the safety data before heating this stuff up! Also, Jack told me that once someone forgot the boiling trilobite, and came back to a trilobite permanently encased in tar (Ordovician meets Rancho la Brea!).
A few caveats. First, I wouldn’t try Varisoft on anything but enrolled trilobites or fossils on top of limestone, because I find that with prone trilobites it will eat away at the shale that holds the trilobite together. As the paper I linked to noted, “However, matrix-supported fossils such as trilobites may fall apart upon rock disintegration in Rewoquat; we recommend that in such cases Rewoquat should be used to clean them on a rock bedding plane.” Perhaps test on a not-so-unique fossil first. Jack has a lot of experience with similar chemicals, so any additional recommendations would be great.
Second, the MSDS for the product indicates that there are definitely appropriate safety measures to take, and that it is very toxic to aquatic organisms. So, please follow appropriate safety precautions (check out page two of this link and the manufacturer’s documentation) and dispose of it properly. Incidentally, you should be able to drain off and reuse Varisoft for a long time. The only amount you lose will be whatever clings to the fossils and is washed off when you rinse them. The way surfactants like Varisoft work, they’re not exactly reacting with the clay, but rather causing the clay to disassociate (those with more chemical training, feel free to correct my terminology), so the Varisoft stays usable. Do NOT pour it out or throw it away when you’re done, or you’ll be throwing away perfectly good chemicals.
So, how to get it? I explained to the manager who sent me a sample that I wanted it for testing with fossils, and that other paleontologists might be interested. I asked whether it would be okay for others to request samples as well, and she said it would not be an issue to get more samples. The only restriction is that they cannot ship to a non-commercial address. I couldn’t have it sent to my home address, but since my wife Christa works in the physics and geology department at Norther Kentucky University, I was able to have it sent to the geology lab there. Jack had trouble in the past with trying to get chemicals shipped and was told that a university did not qualify as a commercial outfit, but I didn’t have any trouble this time. As of yet, I have not been able to get a clear answer about ordering larger quantities, but the sample is a pint, and a little Varisoft goes a long way. If more of you try it out, and are interested in ordering larger quantities (group buy?), then I would ask again. I have the contact information for the manager who can send samples, but I don’t really think it would be fair to her for it to be circulating on the internet for all to see. So, if you would like to request a sample, send me a message, and I’ll send you her contact information. If I have the time, I’ll try to send her a little “introductory” email letting her know that another paleontologist will be requesting a sample as well, so it’s not out of the blue. I’ll also send you a PDF with some safety information about Varisoft.
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